I got a lot more to put up here, perhaps within the next month or so.

Misunderstood Scriptures Re-Considered Carefully


What we want to learn from this is that no matter how much we might disagree with many doctrines of other people, they are likely to have some points they are right in. And no matter how good we are, we can be wrong on a few matters from time to time and have to be always ready to readjust as we have new things pointed out to us that initially escaped our attention. The Proverbs say that if you reprove a wise man, he will thank you. Only a foolish or wicked man would despise someone trying to legitimately correct them. The proverbs also say that in a multitude of counselors there is wisdom and salvation. I seek out other opinions as I feel that is where my best interests and protection lies, if I am to arrive at the truth. So do not block yourself off from those who think contrary to you in some things. I know some who did and do that. They have not faired well and are far from the truth, despite having over 100 years to get at least close to it.

Proverbs   11:14;  15:22;   24:6

I am going to end this section with a brief consideration of some of the Proverbs I refer to with an interesting extra point to note. Green's Literal Translation comes out a bit different from most of the others. Having carefully looked it over, I think Jay Green may have something in his careful literal approach to translation. I do not dispute Proverbs 15:22. It is the other 2 that need some fixing.

Proverbs 15:22
KJV 22 Without counsel purposes are disappointed: but in the multitude of counselors they are established.
GLT 22 Without counsel purposes are broken, but by many counselors they rise.
RSV 22 Without counsel plans go wrong, but with many advisers they succeed.
JB    22 Without deliberation plans come to nothing, where counselors are many plans succeed.

Proverbs 11:14
KJV 14 Where no counsel-(8458) is, the people fall: but in the multitude-(7230) of counselors-(3289) there is safety.
GLT 14 Without guidance the people fall, but safety is in a great counselor.
RSV 14 Where there is no guidance, a people falls; but in an abundance of counselors there is safety.
  14 For want of guidance a people fails, safety lies in many advisers.

Proverbs 24:6
KJV 6 For by wise counsel-(8458) thou shalt make thy war: and in multitude-(7230) of counselors-(3289) there is safety.
GLT 6 For you shall make war for yourself by wise advice, and safety is in the great Counselor.
RSV 6 For by wise guidance you can wage your war, and in abundance of counselors there is victory.
JB    6 for war is won by sound thinking and victory rests in having many counselors.

08458 hlbxt tachbulah takh-boo-law'
hlwbxt tachbuwlah takh-boo-law'
02254 as denominative from 02256; n f;
See TWOT on 596 @@ "596a"}
AV-counsel 5, good advice 1; 6

1) direction, counsel, guidance, good advice,
-----(wise) counsel
--1a) direction, guidance
--1b) counsel
-----1b1) good or wise counsel
-----1b2) of the wicked


07230 br rob robe
07231; n m; {See TWOT on 2099 @@ "2099c"}
AV-multitude 70, abundance 35, great 9, greatness 8,
much 8, abundantly 4, plenty 3, many 3, long 2,
excellent 1, misc 12; 155

1) multitude, abundance, greatness
--1a) multitude
-----1a1) abundance, abundantly
-----1a2) numerous
--1b) greatness


Uey ya`ats yaw-ats'
a primitive root; v; {
See TWOT on 887}
AV-counsel 25, counsellor 22, consult 9, give 7,
purposed 5, advice 2, determined 2, advise 2,
deviseth 2, taken 2, misc 2; 80

1) to advise, consult, give counsel, counsel,
-----purpose, devise, plan
--1a) (Qal)
-----1a1) to advise, counsel, give counsel, consult
-----1a2) counsellor (participle)
--1b) (Niphal) to consult together, exchange counsel,
-----deliberate, counsel together
--1c) (Hithpael) to conspire

In Proverbs 11:14 & 24:6, there is an interesting contrast between KJV/RSV and that of GLT. GLT renders counselors as great Counselor. I believe the definitions require multitude or abundance for 7230 which KJV/RSV do. All seem to agree with wise advice, counsel or guidance, all of which are reasonable for 8458. But 3289 is where it gets interesting. To me, it refers to counsel, advise, consultation or the giving or receiving of those. While it does not prevent those giving it from being called Counselors, the focus is on what is given, not who. So as I see it, 7230 and 3289 which appear right near the end, go together to refer to abundant (amount or quantity) or excellent (quality)
 of advice, direction, guidance, counsel, plans, strategy or the like. Counsel covers it all well. So it should be that it should end with something like abundant counsel or advise. GLT focuses on the singularity of the word and the other 2 focus on where it comes from rather than what it is.

I would also point out that Solomon in writing these Proverbs, may have been referring to God in mentioning  the Great Counselor. Green might have really nailed this one by not assuming he understood the intention of the writer and tried to be as literal in his translation as possible.

So were I to translate this, and I will, it would read:
11:14 Where there is no guidance, a people falls; but in an abundance of counsel there is safety.
24: 6 For by wise guidance you can wage your war, and in an abundance of counsel there is victory.

What I really want to emphasize is that many religious denominations maybe have a point or 2 to offer. We need not fear them and we need to be willing to constantly examine our own beliefs to see if they are solid and can stand up to inspection or critique. I have had to revise this 3 times to date. Admitting wrong or admitting need for improvement or refinement is never a bad thing. Our only concern should be for the truth.

Some only care about looking good and pretending to know it all without any mistakes as if God Himself was directing their every step. They are liars for none is perfect in the sight of God and God looks for humility. Do not be afraid to talk to people with different views from yours. You can always reject their ideas if they are wrong. But I would not be where I am today had I not been happy and eager to talk with those with different views. I have received understandings from a number of sources and valued them all. I have seen some of them not profit at all, though they had lots to learn. They could never admit an error or face facts. Their ears were plugged and their hearts veiled to God.

Always seek other opinions and advise, if for no other reason, than to test what you have, for if what you have is good, it will be able to stand up to attacks without any problem. Truth can never be harmed by lies. Truth is invincible. If what you have is not invincible, then it is not the truth. Now we can move away from how long Jesus was dead and consider the timing leading up to his death.